The Case for the NA Doctorate
#1
Earned doctoral degrees are made up of several types. The one most are familiar with is the scholarly doctorate, which is typically the PhD. (I hold one.) The PhD is designed for entry into academia. However, many mid-career adults go back to school to earn them.

Another type is the first professional doctorate, which has no dissertation and is designed for entry into particular professions. The MD, DDS, OD, and JD are examples.

Then there are the professional doctorates. These are somewhat scholarly in nature, but their emphasis--especially in the dissertation--is on practice, not advancing scholarly theory. These degree titles include the DBA, EdD, DM, and others. (One of my doctorates is an "other.") Many times, mid-career professionals earn these degrees. (But not exclusively.)

Confusing things is the fact that some professional doctoral programs are every bit as scholarly as the PhD. They're really just PhDs with alternate titles. For example, some schools only award the PhD in arts and science disciplines, and professional titles for applied disciplines (like education and business), even if they require a scholarly dissertation. (An original and significant contribution to the theory of the academic discipline.)

The two national accrediting agencies who accredit degree-granting schools and are talked about most on these boards are DEAC and ACICS. Both of these accrediting agencies have their roots in tertiary trade schools. They subsequently began accrediting trade-related associate degrees, eventually moving on up to academic degrees--bachelor's, then master's, and finally professional doctorates.

Because these degrees come from schools that are not regionally accredited, there is some diminished applicability at RA schools. (The degree to which this is true is hotly debated.) Students and graduates sometimes find it difficult to have their credits and degrees accepted at RA schools, either for transfer or for entry into a higher degree program. Again, the extent of this schism is hotly debated, but the available facts point this out.

The same situation exists in the employment sector, where such degrees are not always acceptable to hiring managers and HR departments. Again, the extent of this isn't certain, but both anecdotal evidence and what empirical evidence exists points to a real difference. However, there are anecdotes to the contrary. It's just not know how significant these are in the larger scheme.

Still, I think a strong case can me made for the mid-career professional to consider taking a professional doctorate from an NA school. These are:

-- The professional doctorate is more suited for mid-career practitioners looking to advance both their careers and their practices.
-- Employers are less likely to reject such a degree, while academic institutions almost universally do so (for professorships).
-- Professionals in private practice don't even have employers to answer to, making it even less likely the source of their doctorate will be problematic
-- NA schools are geared towards educating mid-career practitioners. (True for some RA schools and false for many, many others.)
-- NA schools are almost universally less expensive.

Now, the same case could also be made for degrees from unaccredited schools, but it is a much weaker one for several reasons:

-- Recognized accreditation ensures a baseline of quality and acceptability; these are hugely hit-and-miss for degrees from unaccredited schools
-- These degrees, even from legitimate and rigorous schools--are like time bombs, waiting to go off. There is a much greater potential for them to cause embarrassment.
-- While there are a few long-standing unaccredited schools, a persistent lack of accreditation can doom many schools--and make the degrees they've issued less valuable if the school fails
-- The general public (and employers) make much clear distinctions between "accredited" and "unaccredited" compared to "RA vs. NA." It's huge.
-- There is almost never a legitimate reason to pursue a degree from an accredited school these days. Some long-standing, very "niche" schools in California and that's about it. Otherwise, the market has now evolved to serve almost everyone else.

Because the benefits could outweigh the limitations for some people, I think a mid-career practitioner looking to advance his/her career and/or practice by earning a professional doctorate should seriously consider taking one at an NA school.
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#2
(11-30-2015, 01:24 PM)twodocdoug Wrote: -- There is almost never a legitimate reason to pursue a degree from an accredited school these days.

Say what?!?  Troll bait?  Non-double doctorate level proofreading?  An abrupt change of opinion, perhaps the result of years of substance abuse, senility or CTE?
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#3
(12-03-2015, 01:34 AM)twodocdoug Wrote:
(12-02-2015, 05:49 PM)Armando Ramos Wrote:
(11-30-2015, 01:24 PM)twodocdoug Wrote: -- There is almost never a legitimate reason to pursue a degree from an accredited school these days.

Say what?!?  Troll bait?  Non-double doctorate level proofreading?  An abrupt change of opinion, perhaps the result of years of substance abuse, senility or CTE?

Or a typo in a long post. Try responding to the substance, if you can manage it.

Sorry.  Klempner klones must live by Klempner Rules.

[Image: that-moment-you-realize-your-whole-statu...-67431.png]
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#4
(11-30-2015, 01:24 PM)twodocdoug Wrote: -- There is almost never a legitimate reason to pursue a degree from an accredited school these days.


Poor doubledouchedoogle.  He had to go back to the pedophile-pandering porn peddler's website to post his words of wisdom, only to be pounced upon by his stalker/lover Lefkowitz.  Why is it that nobody appreciates your genius? 

BTW, how come you and Paula don't have any kids?  She's a nurse, so I would think she knows how it works.  Aren't you doing your part?

And why does the Richard Douglas Group only have one person in it?  Shouldn't it be titled something more appropriate, like the Richard Douglas Self Abuse Affinity?
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#5
Still trying to figure out why a "case" needs to be made for the NA doctorate.

Situation, not accreditation, is what matters.

My niece applied right out of college to some Top 10 consulting firms with her state college regionally accredited degree 3.9 GPA.  Got turned down by all of them because in that situation they hire from better places.

So why don't you make for "The case for the regionally accredited degree" while you are at it since you seem to assume it has universal acceptance, it doesn't. There are just as many cases where a regionally accredited degree doesn't work. 

Your old guard doesn't really exist anymore nor did it really ever with your phoney litmus test where it has to get you tenure in a state school to mean anything.  99.99% people arent college professors, but hey, if the .01% ever want to one day, the door still isn't closed for them either.

This is post that no one is asking about.  A post to a problem that doesn't exist, at least no more or no less that occurs in regional accredited situations.  the fact that there are much less NA anything out in the world, there are much more cases of regionally accredited degrees not being sufficient in the real world than NA not being sufficient.  Unless of course you want to be a professor at MIGS.
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#6
(01-22-2016, 09:20 AM)twodocdoug Wrote: Making a "case" for the default value is stupid.

The professional doctorate isn't about "college" professors. Can't you read?

There are exactly ZERO situations where a degree from an RA school would be unacceptable BECAUSE of that form of accreditation. The reverse is not true for degrees from NA schools. While the magnitude of the difference can be argued, and can be irrelevant in an individual's situation (hence, my original post, thank you very much), the fact is true that in ANY situation where an NA degree would be acceptable an RA degree would also be so. Again, the reverse is never, ever true. It is disingenuous to imply otherwise.

If you can't discern the difference between national and regional accreditation when it comes to the utility of a professional doctorate, then you're either woefully dumb or willfully ignorant. Your call.

Troll.  Now he's even killing his own threads.
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#7
(01-27-2016, 12:05 PM)twodocdoug Wrote: No, but a nice try at mis-characterization. I realize this is hard, so stay with it. It is okay that (a) regional accreditation better serves degree holders than does national accreditation and (b) choosing a doctorate from a nationally accredited school might be a good choice for some people. That's the distinction here.

Now go ahead. You can do it.

I believe at this point the only issue is whether all your posts also will be deleted when you are banned.
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#8
(01-27-2016, 12:05 PM)twodocdoug Wrote: Now go ahead. You can do it.

A little quicker on the flush next time, Mr. Administrator, if you please.
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#9
[Image: images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRWr8GZLzVH-jvAPNKflkF...j--8k8kyAQ]

I'm not getting why HE cares so much.
Different people, different needs.
I wish I could have 50-100.000$ or more for a RA doctorate...but I don't.
If I HAD that kind of money, I would have other plans.
A.A Mole University
B.A London Institute of Applied Research
B.Sc Millard Fillmore
M.A International Institute for Advanced Studies
Ph.D London Institute of Applied Research
Ph.D Millard Fillmore
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#10
(01-22-2016, 06:29 AM)D00bie Wrote: Situation, not accreditation, is what matters.

...there are much more cases of regionally accredited degrees not being sufficient in the real world than NA not being sufficient.  ...

Doogle seems to have forgotten that he proved in his dissertation that most people don't care about RA or NA, or even unaccredited. 

These days a college degree may just mean you have been indoctrinated into the socialist system a little too well for the taste of many employers, particularly if it's in one of those useless majors that ends with the word "studies."  Or as Maynard G. Krebs used to say, "Work?!?"  Nobody wants a George Gollin type who needs 15 helpers to get anything done, and then you're down half a million bucks and still finish in third place.

Or it may mean that you aren't in the "club," such as Ivy League or whatever regional or social prejudice is operating.  A "yankee" degree in the south can get your resume round-filed just as fast as a non-Ivy degree among the pretentious.
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